Carpenter Wins Cy Young

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 2:02 PM EST in News Comment 36 comments

It couldn't have happened to a more deserving guy. Oh wait - yes it could have. There were at least two other more deserving candidates.

Oh well.

The news.

Even the fool who wrote that article doesn't get it:

When it mattered, Chris Carpenter was at his best.

How is that your opening line? That's pathetic. I'm an untrained amateur and I could (easily) come up with something better than that. I would have at least used facts or a statement based in reality.

Memo to moron: Carpenter had a 5.73 ERA and a .309 batting average against in September.

Update: Dontrelle was named on each of the ballots. And this was the closest finish since 1998. Still, it doesn't feel right. I'd really like to see how each writer voted.

Update #2 (for Viva El Birdos readers/writers with reading comprehension issues): I missed where I was advocating Willis. Sure, I would have liked to see him win the award, but I think Clemens deserved to win. I've said that plenty of times.

I really enjoyed this analysis from a Cards fan:

If you take away Carpenter's last three games, which were tune-up starts after the Cards had already clinched, then he's the clear winner over Dontrelle.

That's cool. So we should ignore some starts from Carpenter and give him the Cy, but note that a few rough outings from Dontrelle (in July) are what should make us discount his candidacy.

I'd like to have a discussion about this with the Cards folks, but since they seem to think there's some sort of an anti-Cardinals and pro-Marlins media conspiracy, I'm not even going to try.

The one valid point that they've made is that the NL Cy Young is not the award we should be getting the most worked up about. That's true. Bartolo Colon is far less deserving of his award than Carpenter is of his.

Final Update (and now the issue is dead to me): I don't think is as big of a deal to Marlins fans as some Cardinals fans seem to think it is. Yes, we're talking about it. Yes, we hoped that Willis would win it (but I doubt there's a Marlins fan alive who actually thought Dontrelle was going to win today). But when it's all said and done, Marlins fans will take recent World Series titles over Cy Young awards any day.

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Breakdown

If someone finds a link to how each writer voted, please post it. I'd like to analyze it a little.

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 2:12 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Is that usually made public?

by Carolina on Nov 10, 2005 2:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I'm not sure

I think it has been -- at least sometimes. When Hideki Matsui didn't win the Rookie of the Year a few years back the votes came out. IIRC, the Minnesota or Kansas City writer didn't even list Matsui on his ballot. That cost Matsui the award and got the writer some love notes from Mr. Steinbrenner.

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 2:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I have heard...

about who voted for which player from sportswriters before but I have never seen the list made public. Could be I never knew where to look.

by craig on Nov 10, 2005 3:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

That may be what I'm thinking

You're probably right. I'm not sure that I've ever seen a complete list. But I'd like to see one.

This is like college football. It reeks of conspiracy since it's a secret ballot. What's the issue with making the details public? If these jokers were held accountable for their votes, maybe they'd do more than scan the standings and the win totals at the end of the season.

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 3:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

This just Sucks!

by craig on Nov 10, 2005 2:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

To: Viva El Birdos

Sour Grapes, my Ass. We speak out when we see an injustice take place.

by craig on Nov 10, 2005 3:37 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

But they're the Cardinals!

They're great fans! And they know baseball so well! And they've waited so long for a Cy Young! And, I mean, really, this Cy Young is like a lifetime achievement award for Carpenter. He's overcome so much having had surgery just a few years ago. It's really so great.

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 3:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Oh, I forgot

What was I thinking, All Hail the wise and omnipotent Cardnials for they are the true keepers of the game.

by craig on Nov 10, 2005 3:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

For Cardinals fans reading this

That comment was made in jest as it summarizes the talk I've heard on sports radio all day today.

None of that stuff is reason to give Carpenter (or anyone) the Cy Young award.

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 4:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Marlins fans will take recent World Series titles

Any day, and twice on Thursday.

Fear The Mig, Believe in the DTrain
They don't suck.

by fishfan24 on Nov 10, 2005 4:05 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

But seriously...

Did they expect us not to talk about it? I don't get it.

Fear The Mig, Believe in the DTrain
They don't suck.

by fishfan24 on Nov 10, 2005 4:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

We're Marlins fans. They're Cardinals fans.

We're supposed to accept our roles as have-nots and let the haves enjoy life. I think that's how it goes.

I really don't know. I'm waiting for someone to tell me how it is.

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 4:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

hey mike42

it's lboros from viva el birdos. sorry you guys are so disappointed. i can understand; dontrelle's a great pitcher, had a great year, was just as deserving as carp. but they only give out one award. close call; the vote just went carpenter's way.

call us smug if you want, but just remember --- we didn't get to vote. i can tell you this (and here's just how smug i am): if willis had won, we'd have been the 1st to congratulate him and the marlins. our guy had a great season; give him his due.

it's not about these stupid awards anyway. it's about trophies --- in which dept your franchise has been far more successful than ours lately. i'd think that would give you all a little bit of solace . . . .

by lboros on Nov 10, 2005 4:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I'm sure

I'm sure you would have been first in line to come over and speak well of Willis had he won the Cy Young Award today. The comments on your site are indicative of that.

Seriously, instead of ripping on what we've written here and running with a typo or two in the comments, why don't you guys talk about what David Pinto wrote at Baseball Musings (and you quoted)? Pinto makes a much better point than me and it's not one that I've seen a Cardinals fan address.

It's moot though. Carpenter, Willis, Clemens, Oswalt, and Pettitte each had a great year. Anyone of them had a case for the award. The tiebreaker was apparently playing on the best team. That's fine.

I'd still take Willis over Carpenter for the long run and I would rather have had Clemens than Carpenter for 2005.

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 5:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I forgot what I said now

Oh well :-)

Fear The Mig, Believe in the DTrain
They don't suck.

by fishfan24 on Nov 10, 2005 4:08 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Sorry!

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 4:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

No Prob, Mike

I think you basically said it with less words in your second-to-last update.

Fear The Mig, Believe in the DTrain
They don't suck.

by fishfan24 on Nov 10, 2005 4:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I feel validated

Steve Phillips thought the Cy Young should have gone to Dontrelle. And Steve Phillips is the GM for like half of the teams in baseball; he knows everything.

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 4:35 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

All of this

is hilarious to me.

I think we should have a Fishstripes/Viva el birdos rumble. We need a serious throwdown here. Lord knows this is the most important thing to EVER HAPPEN and can only be settled by blood.

So let's set a time and place.

I got the hand-grenade.

"Yeah, there were horses, and a man on fire, and I killed a guy with a trident!"

Taking the fun out of it - for everyone.

by wiggins on Nov 10, 2005 5:15 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I registered over there

And want to get into the comments and respond, but I don't see the point. It would take effort to make my case and I'm just not that worked up about it. It's not that Carpenter didn't deserve the Cy Young; I just think that others deserved it more.

The 03 Rookie of the Year award comment really gets me. I can't believe people are still making the Brandon Webb case. Aside from the stats, and I know that people on blogs can't overlook the stats (as that's all we see generally), Dontrelle was a leader and turned a whole freaking franchise around. That's why he won the Rookie of the Year - not because of his numbers.

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 5:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hah!

I think I'll leave the new signature for a while. I like it. Thanks.

Taking the fun out of it - for everyone.

by wiggins on Nov 10, 2005 5:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Tell me you didn't think of Anchorman

Somewhere in all this mess.

I love that bit.

"Boy, that escalated quickly... I mean, that really got out of hand fast!"

Taking the fun out of it - for everyone.

by wiggins on Nov 10, 2005 5:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Still haven't seen it

I know, I know.

by mike42 on Nov 10, 2005 5:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Man, you suck

Now I know why I don't comment on your material.

Taking the fun out of it - for everyone.

by wiggins on Nov 10, 2005 11:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I have to admit I haven't seen it either

is it like the "The Third Man" or would "The Seventh Samurai" be a closer comparison.

by craig on Nov 11, 2005 12:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Seven Samurai, I would say.

Although the "Sex Panther" scene does remind me quite a bit of Welles' "Cuckoo clock" speech from the Third Man, for sheer brillince, if nothing else.

Any which way they are all classics, no?

Taking the fun out of it - for everyone.

by wiggins on Nov 11, 2005 12:47 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It saddens me that I have missed it

at least up until this point.

Actually the damn thing is in the queue and I haven't been moving through the movies very quickly lately. I guess it will get here one day.

Oui, ils sont des lettres classiques.

by craig on Nov 11, 2005 12:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You and your damned French.

I have to sing in French again next week. Another recital - should be fun. I'd invite everyone, but I don't think anyone from the site lives in this area.

Taking the fun out of it - for everyone.

by wiggins on Nov 11, 2005 12:58 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Really now

French has to be easier than Russian.

by craig on Nov 11, 2005 1:00 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It is definitely

easier than russian. I am dreading the Tchaikovsky opera already and that's not until the spring.

I don't mind singing in French too much. I just don't enjoy it polluting the rest of my life, if I can avoid it.

Heh. Sorry. Mike wasn't here - someone had to say that.

Taking the fun out of it - for everyone.

by wiggins on Nov 11, 2005 1:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Dude it's going to make the thread

at some point, might as well get it in early.

by craig on Nov 11, 2005 1:09 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

That's what I figured

Anyway....

I guess I'd better get to bed. Tomorrow is going to be more annoying that I thought since someone decided to run into my parked car tonight and I'll probably have to take care of that with at least part of the day. Bleh.

I wish I could really complain, but I know worse things happen at sea...

Taking the fun out of it - for everyone.

by wiggins on Nov 11, 2005 1:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Good night, my friend

Cars aren't your lucky charm. Be well.

by craig on Nov 11, 2005 1:17 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

By the way -

Iam not really much of a Will Ferrell fan, but this really is a pretty funny movie. We all need stupid movies (well - I do, anyway). I bought this one at the same time I got Harold and Kumar. Good double-feature, if you ask me...

Taking the fun out of it - for everyone.

by wiggins on Nov 11, 2005 1:01 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs